I forgot to mention how my PC got infected, and what my impressions were of the software I was using at the time. My 17yr old cousin was over, and wanted to show me a CD he thought I should download from a fairly popular torrent site (isohunt.com). I told him to go ahead, thinking my (current w/ all updates) anti-malware setup would catch any malicious files. Well, before I could look at what he was doing (we were playing Guitar Hero 3), he had opened IE6 (which was the first mistake-- knew I should have deleted that shortcut!), gone to isohunt.com, and began the dwnld with uTorrent, w/out taking a look at all the files listed, and the type of extensions (mostly mp3s, but a few weird file extensions towards the bottom of the list). The spyware that someone was so kind to include then proceeded to try and hijack my desktop. It modified who knows how many registry keys, and changed my desktop background to a warning and a link to take me to a website that would supposedly "remove" the spyware (likely add more to it!). It even disabled the "Desktop" tab in Task Manager, so I couldn't change it back. It also effectively locked me out of regedit by having it automatically close itself after being open for only a few seconds. Not enough time to navigate to the keys I needed to modify/delete.

ZoneAlarm caught it first, when an executable file was trying to access the internet. Norton was close behind, finding the file that was trying to phone home, as well as several others. Once Norton was done w/ the quarantine process, I did a scan w/ AdAware. It didn't find anything new. So, at the time, it didn't serve a purpose.

I then did a Live Update w/ Norton, as well as AdAware. I rescanned w/ AdAware (it's updates dwnlded faster). However, by the time Norton was updated, I could no longer scan. Some file that had NOT been detected began copying itself, or replicating some other data, nonstop, until it COMPLETELY filled up my C:\drive. If I deleted something, it would have some free space for a few seconds, and then be full again. It was then I found out that Norton cannot scan without some available room in whatever drive it is trying to scan. The virus had effectively disabled Norton antivirus. I was not happy at all with that.

It was time for a fresh install of Windows, anyway, so the next day, I wiped the partition that my O/S resides on, and reinstalled WinXP Pro (more on that later). And, I decided to try some different anti-virus/spyware and firewall programs. Norton uses too much system resources for my taste (not to mention it's susceptibility to be crippled). ZoneAlarm got bought out by Check Point systems (used to be Zone Labs). I don't know if the buy-out was a good or bad thing (probably neither), but I knew there were other things out there. AdAware by Lavasoft, in my experience, has been ok, but I wanted to give some other programs a look.

I use a combination of ZoneAlarm Pro, Avast! Antivirus, and Spybot S&D.

I use Bitdefender.. the net security bundle has anti-spyware,firewall, and antivirus and it was rated pretty high for catching the most stuff. Getting crap on your system is still inevitable on Windows and it still gets bogged down with valid software over the years. Bitdefender was not free, but it's rating was probably above some of the other security packages at the time I bought it, which is good enough for me.

I wipe the Windows HD every 2 years or so and reinstall. That's the solution I've been doing ever since I can remember. It's good to have a backup plan that allows you to not have to worry about a HD crash or virus, so you can either backup important files onto a secondary external HD every month or so and keep it in a secure fire safe or safe deposit box, or you can do what I do and backup your stuff online.

I use a service called JungleDisk that provides client software for Windows/Mac/Linux that is a frontend to the Amazon S3 online storage service. You can skip the middleman and access Amazon S3 other ways, but they're software is convenient and easy to use, which is why I go with it in case I have a crash and need my data quick.

My basic recommendation is: have a backup plan, and forget about trying to keep Windows absolutely spotless for years on end. Shit happens, and when it does, you won't blink twice since you just wipe clean and start over.

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Oc, I agree. However, like Disavowed I try to keep my PC as clean as possible to prolong the eventual wipe and reinstall. Right before my recent wipe I tried a new tool that you get for free by downloading it as part of the Google Pack (beta). I think it was called PC Doctor...? I found it way too resource intensive. Had to uninstall. I eventually went back to Spybot S&D and Adaware, which I've been using for years. I also added AVG anti-spyware and AVG anti-rootkit to give them a whirl.

Spybot and Adaware have been the core of my defense for quite a while. I started using AVG for anti-virus about a year ago, but it's never found a single thing (not that its inept, but I don't think viruses are a big problem for me).

I'd say those tools will keep you clean for as long as you can reasonably expect anything to keep you clean.

I haven't used virus software or firewalls on my home PCs in over 5 years. That's just how I roll. About once a year I'll run a scan and the worst thing I find are some cookies.

I don't use P2P software, shareware, and don't surf websites that are questionable.

I put a lot of faith in my network's firewall, my Mozilla-based browser, and my intuition.

I'd rock Spybot S&D if I had to, though.

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LIVE: EA | Steam: rapturerapture | Xfire: raptur3

I usually spend zero time cleaning off my hard drive or tweaking windows beyond the basic startup processes. I find it boring and tedious to organize files and even more boring to pin down what's slowing my windows machine. And I also like the feeling of formatting a hard drive and starting fresh since it clears up a lot of HD space and ensures that no crap is running that I forgot about years ago. 2-3 hours every 2 years solves 99.9% of my organizing/HD Space/performance problems rather than tweaking and organizing constantly.

No single installation of windows that I've ever owned has kept it's performance up after a few years unless I just didn't install anything period, which never happens.

That's fantastic if you can do it.. but I've never been able to. Something always hoses it up. Plus, I've had a hard drive go bad on me before, losing all the pictures and files. If I'm backing up files anyways, then it's simple that my time is better managed just wiping clean every 2 years.

I suppose my basic point is, virus scan is good at delaying the inevitable. But the best security option is to regularly wipe clean and use the virus scanner to scan the files you re-install from backup. If you really want to go hardcore, use some software to write zeros to or scramble the drive multiple times, then reformat and reinstall. This'll ensure no virus remains hidden somewhere in some sector on the disk.

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@ Oc, I've heard Bitdefender is good. I've also heard that Kaspersky could be the best antivirus s/w out there, but it's expensive (~$50).

@Rap, before my cousin came over, I could say the same thing about my browsing/software habits. But wouldn't you know? The first time I used a P2P site, I got burned. That'll teach me, I guess!

I wish uninstalling IE wouldn't hose Windows. I'd do it in a second. But I HAVE removed the shortcuts to it. I should have added it to the list of programs in ZoneAlarm that don't have internet privileges...

As an aside, commercial AV and anti-spyware companies are making a lot of money off the paranoia about viruses with mainstream users. Anyone ever listen to the Kim Komando show on Saturday mornings? It's usually pretty lame, but sometimes it's the best thing on. Almost every single time I listen to it she gets a caller that is absolutely petrified of physically connecting his computer to the internet because he is convinced that all kinds of bad things are just waiting to jump into his machine when he does. She gets this so often that she has posted step by step instructions on her site to "safely get you connected to the internet."

I've had one legitimate computer virus in my life...in 1998. It's pretty simple: don't download .exes and don't install any programs from a non-trustworthy source. I suppose the finer points of that mantra are more difficult for novices, but the paranoia over viruses among mainstream users really bugs me. I hear people on her show and on Leo Laporte's "The Tech Guy" call in and blame ridiculous things on "a virus." (most often HD failures)

I listen to Kim Kommando occasionally on Saturdays... I actually got a really cool tip from her about a great application to get free music legally.

I use AVG now for my antivirus. I used Norton for the longest time, but I got tired of have to repurchase the subscription, and Norton seems to get into everything when it is on your computer, so when you have problems with Norton, everything goes to pot. AVG seems to work great for me.
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"Don't blow this, Gene!"

@Midnight

That's exactly how I feel. I can't honestly remember the last time I've caught something with my anti-virus software (over a few years). I don't even think I've ever had a piece of spyware flagged.

It makes me wonder if it's really worth my money in the first place. The thing I really like is the firewall functionality that lets me choose what is accessing the internet when. When I first started using it a while back, it would flag all sorts of software that I didn't need to be accessing the internet on a regular basis. Lately, companies have realized that they're not going to get away with it any more and have mostly stopped, in part because of security software. Kim Komando is fun to listen to but I've only heard it once or twice.

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I get spyware almost every scan. Usually "tracking cookies." However, I can't remember ever having found a virus with AV software.

To beat the horse some more, one lady called Kim Komando and said she had bought a red laptop (because she likes red) 6 months ago and had not yet unboxed it because she was afraid of connecting it to the internet. Losing six months of use from your laptop is like losing your teenage years. It won't be a great laptop forever; use it while you can. I know these people exist, and they just need education (there's nothing inherently wrong about not knowing viruses aren't a big deal anymore), which is what Kim Komando helps with, but it's frustrating for me because I'd like to hear something useful.

Using a good antivirus program and having strong firewall software installed is important to me b/c I'm not behind a hardware router or hardware firewall. My DNS server is my cell phone-- not exactly the most secure method to use, but I don't have much choice. I could build a box to sit outside my router, and connect IT to my cell phone, but that would require another dedicated PC. For the time being, I'd rather have reliable preventative measures in place.

At some point, I'm hoping to switch to a PCMCIA card instead of my Blackjack for my ISP. At that point, I can probably find some cheap parts, build a Linux box, put a PCMCIA reader in it, and put it outside my router. Linux drivers for those cards are out there. Or find one of those really expensive routers w/ a PCMCIA card built-in. It might be worth it...

By the time I get around to doing that, I'll probably have cable available at my house.

I did a test a while back. Left a computer completely unprotected for about a year, put it in the DMZ of my router so it was actually not even behind the router either. It lasted the whole year running Windows 2000, but at the end, it'd take a little over 6 minutes to start up. I cleaned it up using pretty much nothing but Spybot and Adaware, and Trend Micro's online virus scan. Yeah, it took a day or three to clean it fully, but clean it they did. Really all you need, is a solid firewall, (if you don't have a router), a decent spyware/adware program, and a decent anti-virus. I've been using Spybot since the .1 days, recently, (2 years ish ago), I found CounterSpy (www.sunbelt-software.com) when they first popped up. Basically the best anti-malware program you'll ever find, and their tech support is pretty quick. They came up with a false positive on my mIRC program, I emailed them and they updated the definitions that day. I've also been using AVG (http://free.grisoft.com) for a few years now too. Works pretty well, and if I need something more, I'll just use Trend Micro's online scan, (http://housecall.trendmicro.com).

DJ

I turned on the Kim Komando replay on Sunday morning. Literally, within 15 seconds I heard:

Let's take a caller; hi Jim!

Hi, Kim. My son's computer has more viruses than the CDC. Other than formatting the disk is there anything I can do?

Well, I need a few more details. Do you know how it got the viruses? Does he use Limewire, peer to peer applications?

He does use Limewire, but not peer to peer.

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I think I'm done with Kim's show. It's just not for me.

can anyone say,TROJANS?